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#1 2005-03-01 21:00:57

NeoArcadian
New Member
Registered: 2005-01-18
Posts: 5

Dimentional Channel

I have been thinking about this one for a while now and have decided to share it to see what other people thought about it.

Many physisists out there believe that reality/the universe is one giant sheet/plane. I can believe this, but, I think it is more of a tunnel like structure.

Supposedly, to create a wormhole you must make a tunnel from one place on the plane to the other. To do this however, you would have to fold the plane over itself like a taco then make a connection from point A to point B.

Well, how are you suppossed to bend the plain in the first place to make the wormhole?

I believe that the plane of exsistance is wrapped around and forms a tube. That way you could make a tunnel from point A to point B without bending anything. Plus, a wormhole is generally thought of as a tunnel. In an exsistance where everything is on a plain it would be very difficult to form a tunnel.

I have also thought of what I call "Repeat Intersections." They are basically a tunnel reality's explanation of alternate dimentions like off of the second Back to the Future movie.

Basically, they are tubes that cut off of the main tunnel and then join it at a point further on. Kind of like a coffee mug handle.

I got the idea for this about two weeks ago and have since written about 6 pages of theories that co-enside with the original. Either way, what's all of your oppinion's?


Reality is theortical.

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#2 2005-03-03 05:29:44

Martin
Moderator
From: Earth
Registered: 2004-10-04
Posts: 380

Re: Dimentional Channel

A nice story does not a theory make. At best, such might be an idea for a Star Trek episode.

Show me the physics.


The truth is out there.

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#3 2005-03-03 23:59:03

Chris
Assistant Professor
From: Longwood University
Registered: 2004-09-30
Posts: 754
Website

Re: Dimentional Channel

Ahh. But Star Trek is no more. Maybe Stargate or some such similar show. smile

I would not like to see the physics, as I am sure it will have tensors or differential geometry or some other crazy math that makes the minds of experimental solid state physicists explode. If it doesn't then I wouldn't trust it anyway.


Chemists are physicists who don't do math. smile

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#4 2005-03-04 13:37:49

M@Man
Member
Registered: 2005-01-31
Posts: 171

Re: Dimentional Channel

I think, perhaps, that a little judicious use of "tensors or differential geometry or some other crazy math that makes the minds of experimental solid state physicists expode" is called for in this case.

For one thing, I think we need to begin with a clarification.  When physicists describe the universe as being like a flat plane, they are obviously talking in higher dimensions than 2.  When we say that the universe is "flat" or "curved," lots of people think of the model of gravity they've seen before: a rubber sheet with heavy balls sinking into it.  The concept is fine, but the dimensions are higher.  What we are actually claiming is that it is 4-dimensional spacetime that is either "flat" or "curved." 

Personally, when talking about the curvature of spacetime, I find it more useful to come back to the ideas of Euclid.  If a space is "flat," then its geometry is Euclidean.  If a space is "curved," then its geometry is non-Euclidean.  An example of 2-dimensional non-Euclidean geometry is the surface of a sphere (hence the term "curved"?).

Now, in a nutshell, general relativity assumes that space may be curved (non-Euclidean), and it gives an expression for how to find the curvature of the space (these expressions are called Einstein's equations). 

So my response to your question, NeoArcadian, is to tell you what research into the geometry of the universe has discovered:

1) Mass distorts (bends/curves) spacetime, resulting in gravity (this is a part of Einstein's equations)

2) The part of space not curved by mass is BASICALLY Euclidean.

So, in other words, until you put mass in the universe, it's almost nice and Euclidean.

I say "almost" and "BASICALLY" because of the discoveries made that the universe is expanding.  The current best model into the inherent geometry of the universe is that it is an expanding Euclidean universe (not in the presence of mass).

So that just about takes care of tube-like universes and coffee-mug shaped wormholes; the experimental evidence just doesn't support it.

Wormholes themselves are actually incredibly interesting distortions that happen in otherwise FLAT space.  We've only recently gone over this in my gravitation class, so I can't tell you with 100% certainty, but I think it is the case that what happens in a wormhole is this:  Imagine a sphere of radius R.  If there is a wormhole at the center of this sphere, then, for large R, if you decrease R, then the surface area of the sphere decreases (like you'd expect.)  At some critical point, however, the area of the sphere hits a minimum, and, if you decrease R further, the area of the sphere begins to INCREASE.  This increase is unbounded, so you can basically fit an infinitely large sphere either outside (LaTeX Image) or inside (LaTeX Image) the wormhole.  So there's basically an entirely separate space on the "inside" of the wormhole.

I hope that was helpful at least a little bit.  Please say so if I've gone too in depth in my discussion.

Last edited by M@Man (2005-03-04 13:39:36)

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#5 2005-03-04 20:08:24

Chris
Assistant Professor
From: Longwood University
Registered: 2004-09-30
Posts: 754
Website

Re: Dimentional Channel

By all means. Lets go deeper.

I am fascinated by gravitation and wish I had the time to take a graduate course in the subject. I'll settle for picking your brain.

M@tMan, can you start a new thread in the appropriate category discussing space curvature and Einstein's Equations? We can start with a basic concetual understanding and build some of the math in as we go.


Chemists are physicists who don't do math. smile

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#6 2005-03-23 05:22:27

Martin
Moderator
From: Earth
Registered: 2004-10-04
Posts: 380

Re: Dimentional Channel

Chris wrote:

Ahh. But Star Trek is no more. Maybe Stargate or some such similar show. smile

I would not like to see the physics, as I am sure it will have tensors or differential geometry or some other crazy math that makes the minds of experimental solid state physicists explode. If it doesn't then I wouldn't trust it anyway.

Tsk, tsk, tsk. Shame on you for labeling tensors and differential geometry as “crazy math!” But at least you trust such math (or, more accurately, distrust theories that lack it! wink ).

I am reminded of Oliver Heaviside: There were many in the scientific community who dismissed Heaviside’s conclusions simply because they did not understand his equations—more accurately, they didn’t trust the mathematics. They felt that mathematical calculations such as his were nothing more than mental exercises that could not possibly have any relation to actual physical results. Unfortunately, such attitudes likely delayed the practical development of long-distance telephony by about two decades!

Math is the Force that describes the Physics. Trust the Force, Luke Skywalker. smile wink


The truth is out there.

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#7 2007-10-06 09:17:15

steve
Member
Registered: 2007-09-20
Posts: 75

Re: Dimentional Channel

NeoArcadian wrote:

"Many physisists out there believe that reality/the universe is one giant sheet/plane. I can believe this, but, I think it is more of a tunnel like structure"


I have a few questions regarding this statement.

Reality is a giant sheet/plane?  You prefer to think of it as a tunnel like structure?   Please explain.

  This sheet or tunnel, what is the sheet existing in?   A tunnel through what? 

When you say tunnel like structure are you saying that it is made of  physical matter?  This structure has solid boundries?

Steve

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